Billy Meier: More Constant than the Speed of Light

Life is funny. Here we have Andy, who’s still essentially an anonymous person, pontificating on, and basically indicting the character of, a man whose life has literally been an open book for over 70 years. Not only an open book but an enormously, uniquely well documented one that speaks loudly and clearly to his honesty, authenticity and…good character.

As far as not knowing how to answer “such a ridiculous question”, maybe it seems ridiculous because of all the assumptions you’ve made and conclusions you’ve jumped to. You say you can’t make an argument based on Meier’s character because you, in your own words, “don’t know the man” and that “the only thing I have heard about his character is extremely negative”. REALLY?

So you have perceived my support for his character? You haven’t watched him in any films, interviews, videos, etc.,and gotten a sense of his character? You haven’t read any of the comments of people who – unlike you – have known him for decades and written forwards and comments to his books, the spiritual teaching, etc.? Yet he’s a fraud, that much you’ve been able to quickly ascertain.

And only out of some sense of adhering to my preference to not entertain speculation do you hold back from telling us how you “could imagine some alternative scenarios that could account for the Meier evidence that do not involve ET’s”. So you’re not big on MMO or character, Mr. Attorney, but you do have a good imagination.

As part of the documentation about your own life and character that YOU’RE creating, certainly for the benefit of potential future clients, you’re revealing traits and characteristics, as well as character values, that aren’t exactly representative of professionalism, competence, objectivity, etc.

Let’s refresh and restate some things that have long been part of the context of the case. Meier, whose physical UFO evidence has been thoroughly expertly analyzed and found to be authentic, devoid of models, special effects, hoaxing, etc., has documented his conversations with the Plejaren down to the day and usually the hour. So we have someone who already has literally out-of-this-world, authenticated evidence for his otherworldly contacts. As far as the contact conversations, it’s long been said in the material that certain things were left out of contacts until after a specific event occurred.

Because of all things that support Meier’s credibility – and his character – I accept as factual the date of the Ice Man contact. I don’t soften or back down at all about it. Since this is one of literally hundreds and hundreds of contacts that have been documented, and since Meier of course never drew attention to it or any other specific information as he published these, I see no motive, as in MMO, for him to have created a lie about when the this particular contact occurred. And the main thing is that he indeed foretold the discovery of the Ice Man…as well as specific, pertinent information about it.

However, Mahesh, Simon and you have made quite a big deal about how all the scientific documentation shows that Meier’s information is fraudulent along with my unambiguous support for it. Now it’s possible that I missed something but it looks like the page that contained all of the SPECULATIVE scientific information that you all were trying to use to bludgeon everyone with is not online. Talk about backdating. Talk about no apologies.

So while I’ve asked a “ridiculous question” that you “honestly have no idea how to answer” you sure haven’t been at a loss for jumping to conclusions wrapped in character assassination about a man whose character and life you tell us that you don’t know anything about.

And to jump for a moment to all that unsubstantiated, imaginative certainty about Meier plagiarizing information about the ozone damage, gases, a-bombs, etc., why didn’t all of you seem to notice that Meier already had mentioned and foretold those things…long before the 1970s?

Of course this is going to set off a new round of attacks as Mahesh and company will be now suddenly demanding proof that Meier published the source documents in the 1950s:

1951 (Meier was…14 at the time):

21. Through the guilt of the people, all storms will assume increasing and more violent forms, such as hail storms, blizzards and flooding rains, as however also the ozone-layer will become very dangerously damaged.

1958 (Meier was 21):

56.) Through atomic contamination of the environment – through atomic explosions, atomic power plants and radioactive waste from industry and hospitals, and so on – the entire life of fauna and flora as well as of humans will be ever more injured and disturbed in health, while also mutations of fauna and flora as well as of humans will appear in terrible ways.

124.) And through the fault of humans, chlorofluorocarbons sluice through the atmosphere, the Earth will burn, and melanoma and non-melanoma skin cancer will take hold and demand many deaths, and all that because, through human irrationality, the majority of the ozone shield, which protects against the rays of the sun, will be destroyed, whereby the atmosphere will be like a curtain full of holes and the strong and burning light of the sun will burn the skin, and the eyes of many people will be permanently blinded.

100.) Also, when nature defends itself against the human madness of planetary destruction, the Earth becomes ever more naked and less fruitful, and through the fault of humans the air will burn, because the ozone shield will slowly be destroyed.

So in light of all of this, we appreciate your going on record with:

“But something that is verified: Meier did not publish anything about the Ice Man before it was publicly known.”

Allow me to predict that this conclusion of yours, and your answer to my “ridiculous question”, is going to speak quite loudly in the not so distant future as to your incompetence, lack of personal character and lack of real research skills, and as evidence also that you also embraced an equally incompetent, highly ambitious and self-seeking attack on Meier’s character.

Amd isn’t it great that you, just like Meier, now have this documented record of what, when and where you made all of your statements, etc.? I wonder if we’ll see attempts on your part to up the quality of your work and character over time, or if this will be the legacy of how YOU were thinkng and acting at 27 years old that people will judge you by in the future.

Fortunately, Meier’s record of his own work and character, going back to his very early years, is consistent, truthful and withstands attacks by those who, because they “don’t know” have to substitute their imaginative “alternative scenarios” for logical deductions that anyone can make by taking all of the known information and processing it with MMO and, of course, the record of the man’s…character.

At least you are consistent in your lack of logical and ciritcal thinking.

Now it appears that suddenly the hammer that you and Mahesh were hitting us over the head with in terms of the all of the scientifici SPECULATION has been taken offline for now at least.

And you say that Elizabeth is unaware that the document was shared with the group. But that isn’t the key question. The key question, the core issue is that Meier had the contact when he stated and transcribed at least the critical content about the coming discovery of the Ice Man.

Since Meier’s CRs constitute a kind of diary or journal, what you’d like us to believe, in fact what you’d like us to overlook, is your implied premise that in this case Meier didn’t have that contact with that content and specific foreknowledge and didn’t write it down as noted. That would of course mean that he indeed has commited some kind of fraud here.

But, as previously pointed out time and again, there’s no evidence he did that. In fact, the evidence based on consistency for decades – as well of course on character and MMO – speaks againt that, plain and simple. So where is your actual evidence that he falsified, as you are indeed claiming? Certainly Mahesh’s contribution is now shrinking faster than an iceberg.

Hurling accusations that I’ve lied, conducted fraud, etc., is predicated upon Meier’s providing fraudulent information. So while it would be nice if Elizabeth, or perhaps other CG members actually saw that document, the fact is that you’re disputing Meier’s honesty and, as you made clear, you effectively know nothing about his character…amazing as that is for someone who’s defaming a man.

So whether the information was disseminated publicly, the core issue will be whether he transcribed it when it’s so stated. You haven’t yet shown any evidence that he didn’t. So much for your two “points”.

Not only are “Mahesh’s fairly damning findings” no such thing at all, especially since at least 1/4 of his pages contained the specualtive scientific information that he was trying to slip by as conclusive of contradictory and fraudulent information from Meier (and to attack me as a liar, etc.), but the points about dissemination – which I am always of course glad when it can be additionally substantiated – are in no way conclusive against his documentation. If Elizabeth had said she saw the info before, then you and Mahesh could’ve said that was anecdotal, unreliable, etc. – which is also why Meier’s consistent, careful documentation of the contacts and their content are so important and which establish his credibility, authenticity and honesty.

Suddenly (or should I say predictably again) all of this posturing form Mahesh, Simon and you is shown to be a lot of smoke and mirrors.

Of course you didn’t comment on the information that Meier published in the 1950s about the ozone layer damage, chemicals, atomic factors, etc., which puts an end to Mahesh’s accusations of falsifications about that issue.

And here you three geniuses are, decades after the facts, trying your best to punch holes in that which is simply the real truth, inconsistencies and all. May we all be protected from any “legal system” and its practitioners who are so devoid of logic, common sense, deductive thinking based on actual evidence, MMO and character.

So it looks to me like if anyone is lying here, it’s the person who posts a so-called investigation with false conclusions…and then hurriedly takes it down when exposed. And what does that make those who tried to use that information to defame, condemn and falsely accuse the other parties?

Fools at best.

Your idea of what gets “laughed out of a courtroom” needs an upgrade. Reread the info on character…and MMO. You’re at a distinct disadvantage in terms of real world thinking, that’s an inescapable fact.

Just consider how many people DON’T have ANY kind of corroboration for their claims, etc., but who do have the character and MMO and, derived therefrom, a preponderance of evidence that leads one to deductively, rationally conclude the validity of their claims, their being in some other place than where a crime was committed, etc.

And there’s also no escaping that you’ve been casting nasty accusations and aspersions based in part on the material you referred to which, as you now admit…you “didn’t really read”. Nice demonstration of competence, credibility and professional ethics there.

I answered the first parts of your question at the end of The Silent Revolution of Truth: I’d simply like to know…HOW he did it. Being a big fan of MMO even back then, my reasoning mind – coupled with my ACTUAL research, not this bogus online armchair expert crap – long ago revealed the impossibility of a hoax.

As to the second part, I think that you’ll find that I lit into skeptics who: categorically called the case a hoax, couldn’t substantiate it (like Mahesh, you. etc.), censored posts containing evidence, falsified my own statements, etc., etc. In other words, you’ll find that I usually played defense with a very strong offense in response to attacks. And of course because I had/have first hand knowledge in terms of lots of research and later my own experiences, listening to stupid, unreasoned arguments amounts to trying to tell someone that they’re not really breathing, or any number of other probably better analogies. It’s just that dealing with the stupidity inherent in attacks such as these is an exercise in extreme patience.

I’ve offered a number of skeptics the proverbial olive branch, offers to cooperate with them (Derek Bartholomaus, IIG, Stuart Robbins, Phil Plait, Michael Shermer, etc.) So at least – unlike you, Simon and Mahesh – I don’t call people liars and promoters of frauds when they are simply stating their point of view and respond to challenges, etc.

Mahesh hasn’t proved that it wasn’t published, let alone that Meier didn’t author it when it’s so stated and dated. He’s only pointed out that there are perceived inconsistencies. Life can be like that and, as already stated, it’s already been long established that certain information is withheld until a later time.

For instance, the Henoch Prophecies mention the attack on the WTC. Well, that just must be a hoax, claim certain skeptics, since it wasn’t published until after the event. But as I’ve already stated there are things in there like the Russian troop movements – also mention of a specific city that they HADN’T yet moved their troops to when the HP went online – let alone when it was first available in German.

Then there’s the Ebola epidemic and info about radical Islam…and a number of other things that are already underway. Since this too isn’t in a vacuum but exists along with the 1950s predictions, as well as the predictions of Jeremiah and Elia, and others that were presented in conversational contexts (Meier must really be only a great novelist) – including the recently corroborated dinosaur and speed of light ones (whether you were “impressed” or not) – a REASONABLE person would consider the preponderance of virtually error free, prophetically accurate information, coupled with Meier’s amazing, authenticated, still irreproducible physical UFO evidence, eyewitnesses, character references, etc., etc., and conclude that he’s not only supremely honest but equally accurate.

Because people have trouble with the nature of the information and evidence in the case they can’t handle it. But if he was simply displaying the same level and amount of accuracy in predicting the weather, sports results, financial trends, etc., people would be praising the hell out of him – and seeking to profit from his advice, information, etc.

Unfortunately the masses are to bleeding stupid to do so, for the most part. So they engage in the terrestrial specialty: attack, maim and kill the messenger. And while people like Mahesh demonstrate a certain frivolous, profit-seeking, cynical lack of being able to comprehend what he’s cajoled people into helping him COLLECT and OWN, he too will have to reckon with the effects. So, if his motivations are other than I say they appear to me to be, then he has no problems awaiting him.

On the other hand…

Andy,

First, I thought I made clear my argument that Meier’s “diary” here has the date of the information well prior to the discovery of body. Also, in terms of consistency, Meier’s history of keeping such specific records of his contacts is well known and further documented. And many good points can easily be raised that leads a fair-minded person to give him the benefit of the doubt as to the accuracy of the date.

Certainly there have been instances when far less controversial or important people’s documentation was presented and judged on this basis…not on whether ANY of it had been publicly disseminated on the date of entry. And also again, this goes to…character; do we have any legitimate reason to assume that in this particular instance Meier falsified this particular information which, please remember, exists in a rather voluminous body much of which has unquestionably been publicly disseminated on or about the noted dates, etc. Is he the kind of person who is known, or actually can be shown to indulge in fraudulent behavior.

I’m sure that you can see that not only were you claiming that Mahesh’s info effectively showed that Meier backdated, etc., but in all of your assertions and utilization of, references to Mahesh’s info…you didn’t state that you hadn’t actually read it, that you were only endorsing certain parts, etc.

It’s not out of the question that if I find more time to comb through every word of it, there’d be more “inconsistencies”, inaccuracies, etc. This does go to competence and character on your part. And I’m simply stating that as neutrally as I can. I think that you’ll find it’s not an unfair critique…especially in light of all the damning comments you’ve made, your base of reference and accuracy being Mashesh’s now already revealed flawed document.

In any sense, how can you try to make an argument with information that you haven’t read in its entirety, haven’t determined the accuracy of yourself and which gets shown to be hugely flawed? This is why I’ve said that there are inconsistencies, not only here or there in the Meier material but in all aspects of human life.

For instance, in 1986 I first saw elements of what we call the Henoch Prophecies in a document from 1981. It has a number of things that are in the 1987 version but there are also differences between the two in terms of what’s in them. Some details are greater or lesser in them and, as I recall, it’s still about events that haven’t occurred yet. So there is indeed a record of withholding of information at certain times, etc. If you were more familiar with the case and its information you’d also know that…and you may not have been so quick to proceed based on Mahesh’s so-called arguments. And perhaps…NEITHER WOULD HE>

The courtroom scenario isn’t that important to theorize about but it could occur in the event that someone was sued for slander/libel, copyright violation, etc. In any of these possible scenarios, it certainly wouldn’t be wise to have as your base of evidence, etc., documentation that you haven’t throughly familiarized yourself with and that some…manicurist couldn’t easily punch holes in.

Regarding questioning “IF Zahi’s reports withstand expert scrutiny”, so far as I know no OTHER experts – or even skeptics – have presented ANY rebuttals and – even more importantly – since now just about anyone can test the nighttime WCUFO photo themselves, isn’t it time for people to TAKE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY for their own thinking?

Oh yeah, since you also defended Mahesh’s attack on Meier’s ozone information, etc., what say about the additional evidence that he indeed knew about and published related info in the 1950s?

Honestly Andy,

It’s pointless to keep going over this. Decide for yourself if:

Meier’s authentic and truthful

If your decision is based on whether you do or don’t agree with my position

As far as I can tell, the jury’s only “out” for those who really – here it comes – don’t know how to think, comprehensively, logically, deductively, etc. Perhaps if you can muster the courage to get out of your comfy little online, virtual, two-dimensional bubble and take your butt to the center, the flimsy unreality of your thinking will become apparent to you…even before you ask anyone there your first question.